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Graeme 'season ticket' Souness
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Posted 4/2/2018 15:31
#1040176 - in reply to #1040073
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness



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Neil Dawson - 4/2/2018 08:54

And presumably Lewis Cook would have been crap had we dropped Surman or Arter earlier so it was good we waited so long?

And Franno needed to play at right back with Smith as sub because Smith wasn’t ready to play in his lifetime position because he needed months of training in it too?

Like SDD said...we have played a back three/five before....notably against Man City the week after a 4-4-2 at West Brom. First two games of the season. Following the logic it takes months to prepare the team to do this how was this possible?



Well of course Lewis Cook wouldn't have been crap had he played earlier Neil.....but would he still be playing like he is now?....as others have mentioned before Lewis had a full summer of football so wouldn't have had the vital conditioning work a full pre-season training schedule provides so it was prudent of Eddie to hold the lad back and make sure he got that conditioning work...the evidence of which is plain to see as he has a completely different physique now....being able to manage a young players work load is a major asset in any manager as it would be in a trainer of a young racehorse...and Lewis has been managed to perfection....he's finishing games as strong as he started them which is something he hasn't always done.
Its no coincidence btw that the players who didn't feature at the start of the season like Lewis...Callum...Fraser...Gosling are now our standout performers....its also no coincidence that teams that started the season on fire like Watford Newcastle and even Huddesfield are dropping like stones......at some point we have to come to the conclusion that our manager knows what he is doing...he's given us no cause to think any differently tbf.
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Posted 4/2/2018 15:35
#1040177 - in reply to #1040176
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness



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Topfarrier - 4/2/2018 15:31

Neil Dawson - 4/2/2018 08:54

And presumably Lewis Cook would have been crap had we dropped Surman or Arter earlier so it was good we waited so long?

And Franno needed to play at right back with Smith as sub because Smith wasn’t ready to play in his lifetime position because he needed months of training in it too?

Like SDD said...we have played a back three/five before....notably against Man City the week after a 4-4-2 at West Brom. First two games of the season. Following the logic it takes months to prepare the team to do this how was this possible?



Well of course Lewis Cook wouldn't have been crap had he played earlier Neil.....but would he still be playing like he is now?....as others have mentioned before Lewis had a full summer of football so wouldn't have had the vital conditioning work a full pre-season training schedule provides so it was prudent of Eddie to hold the lad back and make sure he got that conditioning work...the evidence of which is plain to see as he has a completely different physique now....being able to manage a young players work load is a major asset in any manager as it would be in a trainer of a young racehorse...and Lewis has been managed to perfection....he's finishing games as strong as he started them which is something he hasn't always done.


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Posted 4/2/2018 17:13
#1040198 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness



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He only played 40-odd league games the season before IIRC, so both of you, me and Eddie Howe are still wrong as EVERY OTHER BOSCOMBE FAN said he should have played every game...

...and it's not as if he was only 21 yesterday either.
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Posted 4/2/2018 17:55
#1040214 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Sorry...I wasn’t reading the situation properly...

The whole poor first half of the season was a designed thing while we worked on the correct formation for four months (despite not giving it a go pre season) and conditioned Lewis Cook. We also managed to give Smith plenty of breaks by using Francis so Smith wouldn’t get any fatigue injuries...oh hang on that doesn’t quite fit the theory so let’s scrub that one.

I can’t believe I didn’t spot this. All makes total sense...
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Posted 4/2/2018 18:23
#1040219 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness



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It's perfectly OK to admit you're wrong Neil....no one is going to think any the less of you........go on.... Stick the name Lewis Cook down on that extremely lean looking list of things you got wrong....
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Posted 4/2/2018 18:53
#1040223 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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The only formation I ever understood fully was 2-3-5 ! so I'm certainly no expert but reading the constant debates between you all, it seems that no one is wholly right or wrong, Eddie included; doesn't matter what players or formations get on the field, much of the outcomes depend how the opposition line up and deal with things, plus circumstantial things like injuries or very early goals etc. In the Chelsea and Stoke games it seemed like Eddie and the boys adapted to events perfectly whereas Conte, Lambert and their players didn't! So many angles to look at makes for the phrase, 'funny old game' !
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Posted 5/2/2018 08:06
#1040291 - in reply to #1040214
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness



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Neil Dawson - 4/2/2018 17:55

Sorry...I wasn’t reading the situation properly...

The whole poor first half of the season was a designed thing while we worked on the correct formation for four months (despite not giving it a go pre season) and conditioned Lewis Cook. We also managed to give Smith plenty of breaks by using Francis so Smith wouldn’t get any fatigue injuries...oh hang on that doesn’t quite fit the theory so let’s scrub that one.

I can’t believe I didn’t spot this. All makes total sense...


The sarcastic response would be ok if you were arguing a case about something that someone else was only suggesting due to the benefit of hindsight.

But the fact is, this was a theory that was being discussed at the time, so the mocking doesn't really work.
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Posted 5/2/2018 10:50
#1040326 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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I'm not really sure who has been proved right and who has been wrong in this debate. From what I can understand, Souness' point was playing a 4-4-2 with expansive football is a mistake against teams like Liverpool with their quality and fast counter attacking. Not sure who really could argue with that?

That doesn't mean playing 4-4-2 or expansive football is always a mistake. However, if you look at our more recent games there has been changes. We are still playing relatively expansive football but in a system which has more bodies in the right areas of the pitch to make us less vulnerable to counter attacks.
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Posted 5/2/2018 11:06
#1040331 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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I didn't see anyone think that Lewis Cook shouldn't have been playing every match.

No one on here really knows his physical state and fitness but I would have thought he was in better shape than anyone else. He spent a large part of last season injured, didn't come into the team until the latter part of the season. Played a 3 week tournament then had a holiday and resumed with us. Can't see him being rested until October/November making much sense on the surface of it but as I say, we don't know and I know Eddie does.

I will say though that some of you on here are wasted in your day jobs. How you haven't got our team or even Barnet or Rochdale to the Champions League final and 28 points clear of the PL is beyond me.
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Posted 5/2/2018 12:09
#1040353 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Everyone thought Lewis Cook should be playing (except the two exceptionally perceptional people who worked out that Eddie was resting him so he could win these games in January)

Souness said we shouldnt play with 4-4-2 and attacking fullbacks in a game we lost heavily. Difficult to argue therefore he was wrong. Yes it was with hindsight but he would be out of a job if he said 'I can't offer any insight into Bournemouth's formation as I have had the benefit of watching the match and don't want to be seen as being wise after the event'. Great punditry that would be....

He wasn't as right as quite a few people on here though who not only called that game's formation the same but also stated what we should do. Something Souness didn't. The fact Eddie came to the same conclusion makes it difficult to call them wrong too.

The problem we have is we have a few fans who believe everything Eddie does is part of a great design and that he doesn't make errors. An odd view as part of Eddies great talent and humility is he often owns up to them himself.
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Posted 5/2/2018 12:12
#1040356 - in reply to #1040219
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Topfarrier - 4/2/2018 18:23

It's perfectly OK to admit you're wrong Neil....no one is going to think any the less of you........go on.... Stick the name Lewis Cook down on that extremely lean looking list of things you got wrong.... :35:



It wasn't an exhaustive list TopFarrier, I could have gone on. Anyway glad you took a break from knocking one out to Anglers Monthly to read it.
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Posted 5/2/2018 12:48
#1040375 - in reply to #1040353
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness



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Neil Dawson - 5/2/2018 12:09

Everyone thought Lewis Cook should be playing (except the two exceptionally perceptional people who worked out that Eddie was resting him so he could win these games in January)

Souness said we shouldnt play with 4-4-2 and attacking fullbacks in a game we lost heavily. Difficult to argue therefore he was wrong. Yes it was with hindsight but he would be out of a job if he said 'I can't offer any insight into Bournemouth's formation as I have had the benefit of watching the match and don't want to be seen as being wise after the event'. Great punditry that would be....

He wasn't as right as quite a few people on here though who not only called that game's formation the same but also stated what we should do. Something Souness didn't. The fact Eddie came to the same conclusion makes it difficult to call them wrong too.

The problem we have is we have a few fans who believe everything Eddie does is part of a great design and that he doesn't make errors. An odd view as part of Eddies great talent and humility is he often owns up to them himself.


In fairness, I don't think anyone said it was being done to win games in January...

I also think that it's still impossible to say whether the theory has been proved one way or the other. But the idea shouldn't have just been dismissed because short term it wasn't the right thing to do.

In regards to 4-4-2, that'll always split opinion. Remember being very annoyed that Eddie stuck with it for run in during our first season.
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Posted 5/2/2018 12:54
#1040379 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Souness said...

is my cash in the post, I used to play for Liverpool you know. Those are my principles, and if you don't like them... well, I have others.

AFCB form this season has gone from poor to that's more like it, mainly down to players being not fit and not up to their usual standard earlier in the season. When the team is performing the tactics take care of themselves, scoring goals helps.
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Posted 5/2/2018 13:00
#1040384 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness



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Jesus you're obsessed with that picture Neil!.. It's ok you can put the magnifying glass away I'll find another one that spares your blushes....
Incidentally why is it so difficult to argue with Souness about us playing 442 against Liverpool?... Didn't we take 4 points off them last year by doing exactly that? Ironically he criticised Liverpools full backs for being too attack minded! Only after they lost obviously...
The formation isn't the issue here it's our attacking mindset he can't seem to get his head around.... It's easy to waffle on about plan b after we've been beaten by one of these teams but when you think of our time in this league and some of the fantastic results against the top six we've had simply by playing to our strengths.. Do you think we would have fared any better points wise by adopting a more defensive approach?.... I think it's highly unlikely tbh.
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Posted 5/2/2018 13:01
#1040386 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Eddie has a lot of sports scientists and therefore science behind him. It could be that he felt that Lewis wasn't quite ready for the rigours of the Premiership at the start.

I'mnot saying he's got every decision right, and nor would Eddie, but I'm a long way from being 100% certain that these decisions were wrong. I'll leave that to Neil and others ;-)
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Posted 5/2/2018 13:16
#1040394 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Its not just about the 4-4-2 formation though. Burnley played this against City on Saturday and no one is calling that a mistake.

The difference is having a game plan to make the formation work. We like to keep the ball and stretch the pitch, while Burnley play with 2 compact banks of 4 and get the ball forward quickly to a couple of physical strikers.
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Posted 5/2/2018 13:30
#1040399 - in reply to #1040384
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Topfarrier - 5/2/2018 13:00

The formation isn't the issue here it's our attacking mindset he can't seem to get his head around....


Exactly this. Souness seems hell bent on Eddie adopting a Tony Pulis style approach against the top six. Our own master tactician was crying out for our very own Chris Wood not six weeks back if I recall.

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Posted 5/2/2018 13:44
#1040403 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Some of us trust Eddie's judgement on whether a player is ready, physically and mentally, to play regularly. Players often say he is meticulous in his approach to every match (I'm not convinced about cup ties), I don't see him leaving a talent like Lewis Cook out, without good reason.From what I remember, the club pursued Lewis Cook for sometime before he signed, then Eddie had a season working with him, I reckon if Eddie had thought he was genuinely ready, he would have started him earlier.

I also give Eddie the benefit of the doubt when it comes to tactics and team formation. I only see them play for 90 minutes, 40 or so times a season, It's a bit like Eddie saying to me " Table, old boy. I've watched, Ironside, Phoenix Nights, George Gently and that Andy guy on Little Britain, let me look after the Good Lady whilst you have a beer or two" : )
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Posted 5/2/2018 15:48
#1040429 - in reply to #1040219
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness


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Topfarrier - 4/2/2018 18:23

It's perfectly OK to admit you're wrong Neil....no one is going to think any the less of you........go on.... Stick the name Lewis Cook down on that extremely lean looking list of things you got wrong.... :35:



Tbh mate the silent majority on here are more likely laughing at the Irish bloke that rocked up in the last season or so because he thought it would be a wheeze to tell his mates down the pub that his premiership team is Bournemouth ,than the poster that’s been writing match reports every other Saturday since the days of SOD and his midfield midgets .

Hold on a sec !!! Irish , a chip on his shoulder with the media , hates any fan criticism of management ...Mr O’driscoll welcome to the forum
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Posted 5/2/2018 16:09
#1040433 - in reply to #1039662
Subject: Re: Graeme 'season ticket' Souness



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Which Irish bloke would this be Wallmth?....i'm not sure there is such a thing as an Irish Bournemouth supporter...well apart from Norn perhaps....
It's a strange comment tbh Walmth...personally i'd be delighted if an Irishman decided to support our team....is it just the Irish you have problem with or are you as dismissive of all our overseas supporters?
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